The UK-US political relationship; on the balance?

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Lad
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The UK-US political relationship; on the balance?

Post by Lad » Sat Jul 14, 2007 10:38 pm

I feel it is falling apart. I think Gordon Brown will be taking the UK more towards the EU. Does anyone else get this feeling?
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RE: The UK-US political relationship; on the balance?

Post by Luke » Sat Jul 14, 2007 11:02 pm

The UK-US relationship has been slowly degrading ever since WWII, IMO. But I can't help wondering if the Iraq issue will be what speeds up the widening gap between the two powers. :undecided:
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RE: The UK-US political relationship; on the balance?

Post by appleton » Sun Jul 15, 2007 12:53 am

Of course it's falling apart. Time will tell if it's a good thing. Moving closer to the EU won't be bad but keeping good ties with other countries (such as the US) is wise. I don't mean the Tony kiss mine I'll kiss yours level though :P
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RE: The UK-US political relationship; on the balance?

Post by Lad » Mon Jul 16, 2007 12:25 pm

I think there is pressure from within the EU for the UK to distance itself from the US. I'm not sure Gordon is intending to bow to that though. However, early signs show a distance already, but I was wondering whether that was to just disengage himself with the Iraq affair which is a big vote killer. If Bush wasn't unpopular both in the US and UK I somehow doubt there would be any problems with it at all. Politicians never have much in the way of values; moving with the voters. Shallow.
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RE: The UK-US political relationship; on the balance?

Post by Lass » Mon Jul 16, 2007 12:35 pm

I think there a lot of people who'd like to see the 'special relationship' end. I think it's in Britain's interests to keep it, and probably in American interests too. Our new foreign secretary was pretty quick to deny there is any shift in relations; whether that's actually true or was just said to reassure the US, I don't know. It will be interesting to watch developments after the next presidential election.
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RE: The UK-US political relationship; on the balance?

Post by Luke » Mon Jul 16, 2007 1:32 pm

I know how it'll go for the rest of the EU - Democrat President = EU and America coming together. Republican President = EU continuing to bash the US for another four years.
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RE: The UK-US political relationship; on the balance?

Post by appleton » Mon Jul 16, 2007 3:30 pm

A good relationship is important but not to the same extent Bush and Blair had it going. It really made both our nations look stupid.

Can't see how it's in Americas interest for the relationship to continue. Apart from the fact it needs all the friends it can get right now. Lol, Pretty much like the UK.

I don't think Brown is moving with votes though. Just that he probably doesn't have much in common with Bush himself. I knew it would be a matter of time before someone thought that :P
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RE: The UK-US political relationship; on the balance?

Post by Lad » Mon Jul 16, 2007 9:39 pm

I agree it really does make both nations appear stupid in that special relationship. It is great to have good ties, but that doesn't mean all out blind love!

I do think that Luke has a good point though, for as long as the more conservaitve republicans stay in, liberal europe will continue to create friction.
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RE: The UK-US political relationship; on the balance?

Post by Luke » Mon Jul 16, 2007 11:39 pm

The trouble with the UK-US relationship seems to me to be (a We're too closely attached. It's vital for both our nations that we be friends and allies, but not to the extent that we ignore each others' mistakes. True friends don't ignore others' faults; they help them to overcome them. (b We don't live up to the stated friendship. Politicians say so many fancy words on both sides, but our nations' relationship seems to be mostly diplomatic rather than anchored in actions. (Setting aside the UK's very generous assistance in the Iraq war) Actual, material assistance that we give each other in recent years seems small, or at best a one-sided trade to the disadvantage of the UK.

To follow up on my rushed post earlier (had to get to work), the EU has in past times almost always been positive towards us when liberal Presidents are in office, and opposed to us when conservative Presidents are in office. Look at the Bill Clinton Presidency. He could hardly have been more compliant and friendly with the EU. Ronald Reagan's administration was not really that popular in Continental Europe, and George H. Bush's administration was not popular at all in Europe. However, Presidents like Kennedy and Carter were generally accepted in the EU.
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RE: The UK-US political relationship; on the balance?

Post by Lad » Tue Jul 17, 2007 10:21 am

Like with like. Europe has always been a liberal enterprise and never had a conservative spine. When the former Italian president Berlusconi gave his conservative views on homosexuality he was forced to resign the highest office Europe has, European president. The EU claims to be very tolerant and liberal, but criticise the wrong thing (including Europe itself) and you are in big trouble. The real freedom of speech that liberal Europe claims to offer is actually found much more realistically in the US.
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