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RE: New EU members

Posted: Wed Jan 03, 2007 11:15 am
by appleton
But I can't complain anymore as Matt will be crying at all my negative comments.
Not at all ;) . I think I understand why some people are so anti-EU. The fact it "seems" like we will lose our sovereignty our nation to Brussels?

We won't so I'm not worrying at all about that :)
Your government wasted more for several months in Iraq but no body cared.
Seems to know what he is talking about there ;)
Europe�apply to join the USA, you will love it there � you already speak �American� anyways. Europe will be much better off without you; ungrateful drunkards with bad teeth!
Doesn't appear to there. We have more in common with most countries in Europe then the U.S.

Okay, I see this at the daily express but nowhere else. Isn't that funny? :P

RE: New EU members

Posted: Wed Jan 03, 2007 12:02 pm
by Lad
DodgeFB wrote: Could you run?
I'd be doing well to get 10 votes up here. :biggrin: The Scots get a lot of the funding we receive from the EU (I hate saying "funding" because we give billions more to the pot than we get back out of it).
matt wrote: Not at all ;) . I think I understand why some people are so anti-EU. The fact it "seems" like we will lose our sovereignty our nation to Brussels?

We won't so I'm not worrying at all about that :)
It's all ready gone - don't worry about it being lost! :tongue: The EU courts are over all our courts. All EU laws override our laws (thousands of them). The only two things they haven't got yet is our economical powers (like tax rates, interest rates) and our defence. We can go to war at the moment whenever we like, but the EU would like a European army. The EU controls our immigration, it controls our standards of life both for prisoners down to patients in hospitals. Every week something distinctly British falls as the EU tightens its grip.
Doesn't appear to there. We have more in common with most countries in Europe then the U.S.
We do and we don't. We get on as a nation far better with the US both historically and presently. We have always been fighting Europe, but the US forgave us for owning their country and when they won a war they deserved they were still friends with us. Many countries in Europe have bitter grudges against the UK and this comes out all the time. I can't think of any common interest with France, Germany or Spain. We all speak entirely different languages and have been enemies for years and just because we are not at war at the moment or desiring that doesn't make us friendly either. I think the UK-US relation is very special. We are the only country in the world that the US shares its intelligence and technology with at the level it does.

Okay, I see this at the daily express but nowhere else. Isn't that funny? :p
All I can do is laugh. :tongue0011: I do think that it doesn't detract much though, even if the figures were to be slightly inflated.

RE: New EU members

Posted: Wed Jan 03, 2007 12:38 pm
by appleton
I'd be doing well to get 10 votes up here.Biggrin The Scots get a lot of the funding we receive from the EU (I hate saying "funding" because we give billions more to the pot than we get back out of it).
You up in Scotland should be happy you get anything at all! :P
It's all ready gone - don't worry about it being lost!Tongue The EU courts are over all our courts. All EU laws override our laws (thousands of them). The only two things they haven't got yet is our economical powers (like tax rates, interest rates) and our defence. We can go to war at the moment whenever we like, but the EU would like a European army. The EU controls our immigration, it controls our standards of life both for prisoners down to patients in hospitals. Every week something distinctly British falls as the EU tightens its grip.
Nope, Nope, Nope. It's clear a EU army will need to be set-up at some stage requiring troops from some countries. That's to be expected.

The EU doesn't control patients in hospitals. There are very loose rules for prisoners in prisons set out by the EU though.
We do and we don't. We get on as a nation far better with the US both historically and presently. We have always been fighting Europe, but the US forgave us for owning their country and when they won a war they deserved they were still friends with us. Many countries in Europe have bitter grudges against the UK and this comes out all the time. I can't think of any common interest with France, Germany or Spain. We all speak entirely different languages and have been enemies for years and just because we are not at war at the moment or desiring that doesn't make us friendly either. I think the UK-US relation is very special. We are the only country in the world that the US shares its intelligence and technology with at the level it does.
The U.S/U.K relationship is only special because governments past and present have made it so. *Wonders if Tony is cheating on Cherie with George*

Just because we speak different languages that does not mean we differ greatly. Simple things like culture, cars we drive (the smaller ones). We have a whole lot more in common with Europe then the U.S. What we have with the U.S is a good relationship. We share some history but we have more in common with culture in European countries.

We only went to war with Germany. They forgave us haven't they? They have said they want that particular part of their history to be blacked out (it will never be so though!).

A tour around Europe and you will see just how much we have in common.
All I can do is laugh. Tongue0011 I do think that it doesn't detract much though, even if the figures were to be slightly inflated.
I try to get my news from several sources to try and maintain a balance somewhat!

RE: New EU members

Posted: Wed Jan 03, 2007 1:29 pm
by Lass
We differ greatly from our European counterparts. In fact, the other European states differ a fair amount from each other also. Pity I've got no time right now to launch into one of my anti-EU speeches lol. ;) But for one thing, our legal system is very different from that of other European countries, yet there is, sometime in the future, to be one legal system for the whole of the EU. It's absurd - ridiculous - unbelievable - whatever lol. And it won't work in the long run. You just can't force sameness like that, where it - historically, culturally - doesn't exist. My best hope for the EU is that it will collapse on itself, fail for the very reasons it stands; it tries to unite, but forced unity will ultimately result in greater divisions IMHO.

RE: New EU members

Posted: Wed Jan 03, 2007 2:40 pm
by appleton
But for one thing, our legal system is very different from that of other European countries,
Every countries legal system is different. No two countries are the same :)

It's not absurd or ridiculous at all as long as the laws are realistic!
My best hope for the EU is that it will collapse on itself, fail for the very reasons it stands; it tries to unite, but forced unity will ultimately result in greater divisions IMHO.
That will make a lot of people poor. That's not a hope at all :( . I hope it doesn't happen. It won't happen :)

What I am trying to say is the same changes can be met historically and culturly as long as they are realistic. The EU needs to make sure it does not start setting unrealistic goals for itself in these upcoming years.

This thread has hit 4 pages and no doubt can hit many more :P . I'm off to give someone's PC a healthcheck. Will pop in later ;)

RE: New EU members

Posted: Wed Jan 03, 2007 3:58 pm
by Lad
This is a great discussion, but like Lass I'm up to my neck in revision for my exams. I'll see what I can contribute later, but I'd like to write a bit more and write a bit better too as the ones here are limited to just a couple of minutes and I'm not very logical in that time!

RE: New EU members

Posted: Wed Jan 03, 2007 4:00 pm
by Lass
You're right to say that no two countries have identical legal systems. But as far as English law goes (English, as opposed to British law; Scotland has a separate system), it has a totally different foundation/history to European law. It has been built up over centuries, moving with the tide of English history. It would be absurd, I think, to replace it with a whole new system that is foreign to England. The financial cost would be crazy, but the cultural loss would be greater still. What respect does a nation have for itself if it can give up one of the great pillars of its society, in favour of an untried, untested replacement?

The way I see it is that human beings aren't robots that can, at a government's will, be placed where it is most convenient to have them and treated in a manner that is politically helpful at the time. People just have enough of it in the end. I've had enough of it already. ;)

RE: New EU members

Posted: Wed Jan 03, 2007 4:02 pm
by Lass
[quote=Lad]
This is a great discussion, but like Lass I'm up to my neck in revision for my exams. I'll see what I can contribute later, but I'd like to write a bit more and write a bit better too as the ones here are limited to just a couple of minutes and I'm not very logical in that time!
[/quote]

Neck? I'm up to my eyes lol. You wouldn't think so, would yah? ;)

RE: New EU members

Posted: Wed Jan 03, 2007 4:20 pm
by Romulus111VADT
I've been reading this post as it went along and it absolutely amazes me to read your posts. I mean it's begining to sound like the EU is just like America was when it was just becoming a country....lmao....this can't be a good thing.....
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RE: New EU members

Posted: Thu Jan 04, 2007 10:19 am
by Lad
In the summer holidays I plan to have a really big thread for the subject. A thread where I can devote more justice in discussing what is one of the most influential bodies in the world. It's annoying having to write off short points and I'm not getting my ideas across.